Luke Smith in September 2015: "The frustration is not surprising to us ... I think we didn't do a great job of explaining [locking content behind DLC] ahead of time, and in fact needed to do a better job ... we also haven't done a great job explaining what is content players own."
, via Kotaku's post-TTK 2015 interview. (Timestamp @ approximately 37 minutes, direct link included).
Bungie knew this was an issue more than two years ago. Yet, instead of actually explaining things ahead of time for CoO, they locked even more stuff behind a DLC paywall.
What happened here, guys?
THIS is why their latest attempt at apologizing smelled funny. We've been through this before. And these fuckers gave the exact same answer last time 2 YEARS AGO.
Remember when Luke Smith had integrity back in his 1up days as a journalist lambasting game devs who do this kind of shit?
He has become one of those people that he used to hate.
A greedy lying hypocrite.
This clearly shows the problem with the entire game:
We'll do a better job communicating We'll be more transparent We've learned so much We're listening
All this is deja vu from a few years ago. They have either learned nothing, or are lying
This IP has been incredibly mismanaged from the start. Nobody has a clue what's going on.
You see that answer was PS exclusive, so this time its just the same answer that's finally unlocked for Xbox players.
You either die a hero or live long enough to see yourself become the villain.
You own nothing.
This is the exact same strategy as EA, apologise and don't fix
Bungie has become EA
Its lying, as always.
They say those sorts of things to try and quell negativity around their product so they can continue spoon feeding bullshit.
They know exactly what they are doing. Its all calculated. The only way it changes is if it becomes more profitable to make a better game than a more heavily monetized one. Thus the loss in sales and the loss of DLC purchases needs to sting, or else the cycle of lies and screwing consumers will continue over and over.
Hes a scummy little fucker.
even worse, he used to ghost write for Kotaku
This is why I don't believe them when they say they're going to communicate more in the future. I've heard that before. Same song and dance.
Shouldn't the content I own be the content that I paid for? Or is that not how the entire world functions now?
Common misconception is that this is big bad Activision's fault, but Bungie actually owns the IP and has final decision on everything. Activision isn't involved in the design process at all apart from the 10 year contract's terms.
Hero's never die!
Wait, wrong sub.
That's why I'm actually proud that I haven't bought the DLC. That is such a sad thing to have to say.
I almost caved in on release day when a clanmate started it up whilst in a party chat, and he's all hype looking at new stuff.
Then I loaded up the (non-DLC) patched game and realised all the ways they really try to push you into buying it. And then I found out what was locked behind the paywall, things I had access to a few hours before and that they'd since removed from my game experience.
I had been withholding my money until at least I'd heard views and reviews on the state of the DLC, but it was actually that moment I realised that the principles of this were more important.
I think we all need to realize that Luke Smith is more PR rep and less game designer or creative director. If we really believe he is the architect for D2, then he really is the sole person to blame and should step away from D2 content going forward.
Everything he says about Destiny -- the exact opposite is closer to the truth. This resurrection quote just proves he's been pulling the con job for years.
And PC players. D1's reputation on PS4 probably carried D2 a long way in the PC preorder market.
If you want to really laugh go read his old halo 2 review and then look at Destiny 2 review. I thought I was going to die I could not stop laughing.
I have no clue why people praise Luke Smith. I don't like the guy. People say "oh, he's not greedy. he's a real player. look at his rank in WoW!". doesn't mean shit. they keep talking out their ass on how they understand the players but then they pull off this scummy shit. ffs
I think it's clear at this point, this has little to do with Activision. Bungie is incompetent.
Anyone else getting the feeling that Luke Smith might have had less to do with the amazingness that was Kings Fall than he is credited for?
It kind of seems to me now that it is more likely he took credit for a bunch of other faceless Bungie employees amazing talent and work.
I have a hard time reconciling how great the game got from that point on to the utter shit show it is now.
Even their apologies are a re-skin.
Spartans never die!
Wait, wrong game.
This hasn't been true for a long time now. You don't own the content or the game and probably not even the disc. What you purchase is a licence that entitles you to play their game and content.
Destiny is owned by Activision though right? It's not surprise.
he is the architect for D2
So he's the fucker who keeps killing me!
....and he is still here 2 years later making the same mistakes.... I would have been fired tbh.
The exact opposite of this is true. People keep putting up Activision as the bad guy when interview after interview shows that Activision is not the one making these decisions. Activision is the publisher, which means that they distribute the game. They do not design the game and they do not own Bungie or the Destiny franchise. Destiny 2 is what it is because the higher-ups at Bungie wanted it to be this way.
And they've been doing it constantly, that's why it always drove me crazy when people would just immediately forgive them when they'd do it. I'm glad most people are finally starting to realize bungie is full of shit.
I'm sure Activision enjoys the decisions they made but they're killing a cash cow that could have paid out indefinitely. They have a very narrow business outlook but such is the sign of the times. It's not like the current decision makers get paid based on sales of Destiny 7 in 20 years.
Mistake? This was the plan. He did exactly what he meant to.
Man, I remember this sub before D2 released,
Luke Smith is at the helm! Luke Smith, who designed VoG and TTK! D2 is going to be fucking schweeeeeeet!!1!one!1eleventyone!1!
The entirety of D2 will be as good as VoG and TTK combined! Planets will align, peace will span the globe, humanity will reach a new stage of enlightenment! There is no way this game can't be good with Luke "Jesus reincarnate" Smith in charge!
I'm not sticking up for him, but I have been lurking around this sub for long enough to remember the circlejerk.
All Ive ever seen from him is pure grade A shitbaggery.
Granted i haven't followed Destiny moment to moment, but I have literally never seen something positive from him, and have several notable memories of his lies/bullshit.
Tomorrow never dies! Wait, wrong movie?
Luke Smith: If I fired up a video right now and showed you the emotes you would throw money at the screen.
Explaining a shitty move ahead of time doesn't make it less shitty.
Just warns people they're about to get shit on.
I would say "if revealing the exact plans of the DLC ahead of the release of the base game would inspire a shitstorm from fans, then your plans are the problem. Not your communication"
This. This has been true for a long time and if you spend some time on Google you can find that courts have upheld this. Its why I resisted going digital so long. Resistance, however, is futile.
Activision isn't involved in the design process at all apart from the 10 year contract's terms.
Can you show me where you're getting your information? Because I'm pretty sure you actually have no idea what core philosophies such as monetization through microtransactions are in the game due to Bungie as opposed to Activision. I hold them both equally accountable.
Funny enough is that there hasn't been any reply to the shenanigans of CoO yet. Maybe in today's TWAB but still.
I think it's more likely that he was promoted outside of his comfort zone. Designing a raid is one thing, designing a DLC/entire game something else.
I believe it is in the contract that leaked a while back. Keep in mind that the contract may have changed. But iirc, the contract was structured so that the release of the content was set (Base Game, DLC1, DLC2, Large Expansion, DLC3, DLC4) but after the first year that blew up because it was not sustainable. Activision was looking for a two year cycle. If Bungie does not hit certain sales goals, I believe there are penalties in the contract that include loss of Activision Stock and reverting the IP to Activision. It actually calls for 4 games - but again could have been amended. Here is the link:
Absolutely. A number of PS4 players switched or purchased the PC version in addition so they could play with PC friends.
When people stop throwing money at their screens.
STOP THIS MADNESS IN THE NAME YOUR KING!!!
Art Vandelay is the architect for D2 I believe.
Good lesson for holding off on release day too. No point in preordering a game, and especially dlc, before you know what you are getting.
I honestly feel that this is what it's coming to. I paid $100 bucks for a game and two expansions. I got half a game, and an update. There is no way they can justify that CoO was worth $20. Maybe $10 but seriously?
"You have allowed this dark lord to twist your mind, until now, until now you've become the very thing you swore to destroy."
Yeah more of “become legend and get all that loot, guardians!”
I think I have a theory, I could be completely wrong. But maybe Bungie is purposefully doing these dumb decisions on purpose so that when they eventually "improve" the game, it seems a lot better in comparasion.
Luke Smith would’ve been fired from McDonalds by now
Make no mistake, they are keenly aware of ways to make a "better" game.
That is why shit like this and Battlefront need to get called out and met with mass hostility. Games are sabotaged and actively made worse to open paths to extra monetization.
Its not new blood that is required, rather than fanbases not accepting the bullshit companies like Activision and EA try to push on consumers.
GET ME THE DLC STRETCHER BEFORE I️ PISS MYSELF!!!
Yeah I didn't pre-order either. Well actually I did just to get beta access, was thoroughly underwhelmed by the beta (it confirmed many of my suspicions), then cancelled the pre-order after a few days.
Launch day I did drive an hour round-trip at midnight to go buy the game, because I had no idea that it would actually have taken such a step back in content.
Put it this way, if D3 was announced anytime soon I would DEFINITELY be waiting a month at least after release. And to be blunt, if it's the same team making it, I think I'd just pass. I've never had as much drawn-out annoyance and frustration from a piece of entertainment as this. This is meant to be FUN.
Lessons have been learned, trust and respect has been lost.
A DOTHRAKKI WHORE!!! ON AN OPEN FIELD!
Activision is a publisher - one that publishes a helluva lot of games btw.
What other Activision published games are in as bad of a state as Destiny 2 right now?
Bungie is the problem.
Wow. "You don't own access to heroic strikes"? That's their excuse?
He's got brass balls. I'll give him that.
Meanwhile at Bungie HQ...
...is about to receive a slew of FREE updated content for Christmas. A map, new weapons and armour, a free supply drop per week, as well as weapons and gear earned through holiday challenges. Courtesy of your neighbourhood boogeyman - Activision - for a game that came out AFTER Destiny 2... you feeling me homie?
So, Call of Duty basically is about to receive a Curse of Osiris-tier update, for free.
Activision - a regular devil.
KING IN DA NORF
If we use his Twitter title "Game Director at Bungie" -- I think it implies he is the boss at the top for the game design of D2. He was the guy who publicly revealed the game to the world and certainly seemed aware of everything that was shown that day.
I think for me, I assumed he was the guy at the head of the team that created D2. He came up with the D2 story (which is a highlight for D2), and the same roll weapons decision, turning PvP into 4v4, introducing bright engrams, moving toward a 2 primary weapon 1 power weapon loadout, etc.
Maybe he isn't so close to actual in-game decisions and maybe he's moved on to the corporate / monetizing side of the game or the idea that CoO was a representation of a D2 DLC.
Maybe he's the Strategic guy at the top of D2 and not the game creator guy.
The idea of the story being a highlight is sad.
It's teenage level writing.
Vanilla Sandlot was way better than SL2
That EULA is a breach of EU law tho, so it's not legally enforceable.
Depending how much they gonna breach EU law, it could be a nice feast for lawyers angling for class action suit.
But that's where they are. They deliberately only break laws that are too much of a hassle for a normal person to sue, and did not attract too much attention for a class action.
They usually have a bunch of legal teams that are super expert at "playing" with the law
Eventually, you have to realize: these aren't "mistakes" or "issues". This is what they intended all along: the core game is perpetually locked behind DLC because it's a subscription game. The pattern is consistent enough to show this isn't a one off accident, or a failure to listen to the community.
Destiny is a subscription MMO, and the DLC releases are the monthly subscription rolled into periodic payments. And by comparison, it's a tiny fucking MMO in the market dominated by enormous worlds to explore.
They will never "get better". The game will never not be exactly this. It's a subscription. Always has been, always will be.
Become suckers, Guardian.
The Spirit Never Dies!
Wait, Wrong Song
Guys, The Division is (finally) soooooooo fun.
The more I play and read about D2, the more I realize D1 was the best game I've ever played, and there will be no proper sequel.
Killing a cash cow that could have paid out indefinitely
That's the point. With the scummyness that is lootboxes gaining more and more attention every day to a point that countries are trying to decide if they should be illegal or not, all of the bigger, less ethical companies are trying to cash in while it is still a tolerated business practice. They are killing the cash cow and selling her as parts.
ya they are simply re-launching Destiny 1. D2 is the EXACT games (minus all the improvements made throughout the gaems life) as D1 vanillia, and they figured they could monetize everything back to the current state.
Guys, Overwatch is soooooooo fun.
I don't have the same feeling about Luke Smith. I feel like there are plenty of people above him in Bungie and Activision that call the shots about a lot of the things that he ends up taking the blame for.
Idk what else he could've said in that situation. "Oh yea the suits at Activision and Bungie told all the employees to stfu about the locked content so it doesn't hurt preorders and sales"
I'm not saying he's 100% innocent but I honestly think that like 90% of the shit he's blamed for wasn't his decision to make.
What you just said... is what companies bank on and why the gaming landscape is what it is. They bank on preorders and season pass purchases. Preorders, season passes, and the lootbox model are why games have become so anti-consumer. And its the people who buy them that allows them to just keep doing it. Throwing money at "non-products" is not the way to go about things. "Here's money for a game I can't play for a month or a few weeks." "Here's money for the simple idea of future dlc despite the fact that I don't know what that content will contain." So please... just stop preordering. Buy the game as a product not an idea. Same with DLC. I remember how it was when companies started doing this after years of gaming NOT being that and becoming angry because I knew how it would turn out. And here we are... where buying "non-products" is normalized.
Bungie is shit now, not crazy.
Guys, Warframe is soooooooo fun.
Ah, the 'ol Ajit Pai method. "I'm going to fuck you and there's nothing you can do about, just letting you know ahead of time"
Squeeze me, should have read "Name one game PUBLISHED BY ACTIVISION"
That isn't true of games like Destiny or anything other games that rely on online servers that can't be player-hosted. Software as a service coming into the gaming world.
There will be nothing in the TWAB today addressing any of the complaints of CoO except for the PL bug. They are still trying to sell DLC's, they would never admit that there is anything wrong with it.
Kind of a symptom of the corporate production world. You're given too little resources, work with a significant number of incompetent "only here for the money" type people, and are given a constant "K, but we really want this" micro-management attitude by managers. It jades people.
Destiny 2: Steps Back
Bungie lie. Every single promise they make that isn't right in front of your face, and then some.
Can't wait for the TWAB. Can't wait for next DLC.
We will never die! wait wrong reality
Its great to see the fanbase finally get mad but this is long overdue. This uproar is residual rage from the EA debocle. A few examples:
In vanilla we had nightfall strikes. When TDB dropped, older players could not play nightfall on weeks when dlc maps came up. They came up a lot.
In vanilla, the nightfall gave you an xp buff for the week. It was later taken away to extend the grind.
They have routinely release content with a loooong grind, then right before a new dlc they shorten the grind to encourage people to come back. Over and over. Instead of creating more content, then pushed levers to move the carrot on the stick. Smh
When Xur came after TDB he brought DLC loot at disproportionate frequency vs vanilla loot. This was soft bullying of fans who didnt buy the dlc but nobody cared. Bungie said they couldnt change Xurs loot. This was later revealed to be a lie.
When the game was being promoted in 2013-2014, it was sold as a game one could play alone or with friends. When it was released it was exactly that. Down the line they added a mandatory matchmaking requirement to run strikes. Why should you care? Well.... now you are a slave to PS+ or XBLGold if you want to run strikes. Even non-heroic, non-nightfall strikes. No one cared. This was the biggest theft in the game’s history. If you bought D1 day one and didnt play D1 again til today you would have less to do.
Routinely Bungie took away beloved weapons for the excuses of game balance between dlc expansions, then used the rerelease of the exotics they stole as hype for future content. The only reason my old one doesn’t work is bc they rendered it obsolete with light level increases and no means of powering up (etheric light excluded). They even used GHorn, community favorite and recently thieved, as pre-order fodder to push sales. Slimy and lowdown.
Those that complained about these things were shouted down by mindless corporate slaves. I guess they finally took it too far if the slaves are throwing off their chains.