I seriously hope this doesn't mean Tomi Lahren will now be idolized as some feminist martyr. It's disgusting that she's been silenced for being pro-choice BUT this is the same woman who reveled in spewing racially charged narratives and refused to look past her privilege. What's the point of standing up for women's rights if you simultaneously put down minorities?
Someone pointed out on Facebook that all republicans who switched their viewpoints did it for selfish reasons, i.e., it suddenly influenced them and they changed their tune. See Meghan Kelly when she got pregnant, suddenly for maternity leave. Republicans staunchly against homosexuality, have a child who is gay, and suddenly they are OK. So my guess is Tomi...
Glen Beck had said that he would have no problem having a pro-choice host. I guess he changed his mind.
As much as i dislike the republicans: isn't that human? Experiencing the things you are against from a different viewpoint, better understanding the opposing side, therefore changing your opinion.
As a girl who ended up not aborting, I am more pro-choice than ever. It is your life.
First of all, I would like to apologize in advance for the numerous grammar mistakes I will be making, since English is not my first language. Also, I am very tired and my head is foggy writing this with less than 3-5 hours sleep for the last 2 weeks, so there is a possibility this will be a incomprehensible mess.
Quick back story: I am 21-years-old with a baby who is 1 year and 8 months old. I became pregnant at 19 for my then-boyfriend-ish dude. He isn't really in the picture anymore, with his whole heart. He has his own life with a new girlfriend, he studies, he parties, he goes on vacations. He has a fun and active life. That fun and active life doesn't leave that much of time for our daughter. His effort is maybe once a month, usually a lot less, reaching out to ask how she is doing, otherwise it is 99% of time me who sends the whatsapp messages (who are left unanswered) and calls (who he seems to ignore happily pretty often), trying to get him see our daughter.
He doesn't pay child support since he is a broke student, but most of all we had a deal of leaving third parties out of this to have his relationship with her as good as possible. In his words, he will make it up with love with what he can't pay. Obviously I am considering to break our "deal" since he has 0 respect to it anyway. It will be a long, exhausting fight where I will be the cruel, money-thirsty manipulating bitch, his new girlfriend will see me doing this because I want to sabotage their relationship and he will be the victim.
Anyway, this post wasn't about my ex, I don't know why I wrote about him. Maybe because I just saw his instragram travelling photos from exotic beaches and felt a sting of jealousy and saddness.
As I said, I was 19 when I became pregnant. You know those girls who say "I always wanted to be a mother!"? Yeah, I am the complete opposite of that. I can't understand that, like someone would be speaking a different language. What do you even mean with that?? How can someone dream of having children? My first instinct was to abort, immediately after I took the test. I don't like kids. I never wanted to be a mother. I never, for a second, dreamed of having kids in my life.
My then-boyfriend, took a strong pro-life stand, but made it clear he will respect my choice even if I abort. He didn't push or bully me to anything, let's make that clear. What he did do, though was that he did manipulate me with a rosy view how fun it will be to play with our little kiddo. In his mind it was only ponies and rainbows. I thought we will raise this kid together. He told me so, very clearly.
I did book an abortion date. The days before that after school I spend scrolling through pro-life-websites, youtube-videos, sites (even reddit) where women like me where called a whore, why didn't I use contraception, this is my punishment, I will go to hell for this. I could spend 9-10 hours glued on my phone and fall asleep at 3-4 in the morning, since I was too anxious to sleep. My mom was the only one who was relieved that I will abort and supported me. My crazy religious relative (the nuts one in our family) who got to know about my situation and harassed me that I will "pay for my sins". Good stuff like that.
I live in probably the best country in the world for women. I am not religious. I have never been religious. My country's overall position to abortion is very relaxed and respectful towards the women. The conditions to keep my child as a poor (well, let's be honest, I had no income then, have no income now) woman are the best in the world. We have a fantastic welfare system, free health care, free education. Everything. I saw that a lot on those so called pro-life sites, and have seen them later on. Women who say they are feminist and want the conditions to be so well women don't have to abort. I had those conditions.
From that day I became pregnant (or let's say, more precisely, that first day when I started to scroll those websites) I have lost my real will to live. That kind of will that makes you dream and enjoy life. That kind of passion where you look forward to things. Where you are anxious to go to the world and fight for your place in life. Anything can happen, life is so exciting and fun. That was my life before I became pregnant. I had dreams of university, maybe a foreign husband, erasmus, travelling, partying, experiencing. Learning languages, dancing till the morning, drinking, making friends.
The day before my abortion I had the worst panic attack, my first. After that there has been plenty. I cancelled my abortion the morning of it. I felt enormous relief.
Let's be honest about the reasons here: I, a person who was raised in a very non-religious-only-namely-christian household, was convinced I am going to hell if I do this. Yes, you read that right. I would never confess this to anyone else, ever, but I did not keep this baby because I saw a future with her or because I wanted to, I did because I did not see that I could terminate it now. I felt 100% trapped, everything was over. The mistake was already happened, nothing could save me anymore. Either I was going to be a baby-killer or then I was going to have a stupid, boring life. No good options.
I am more pro-choice today, as a mother for a very challenging but beautiful almost 2 year old, than ever. I know motherhood now. I know what my life is now when I had this child. I lost myself. I am still not in the university because I can't concentrate on reading for the entrance exam with her. I am trying this year, but it won't happen. I am exhausted. Money is tight and it is very strictly controlled, even though because I live in an awesome country I am not missing anything.
More than anything, life is lonely. My friends are living their own life, no one is a mother. I am the boring, frumpy shell that is nothing like what I used to be. I have strecth marks, my boobs are sagging at 21, I am overweight. I had a very difficult and painful birth that still manifestates itself today in form of me having trouble of holding on farts. I don't use make up anymore, nor do I dress up since I don' have money for clothes and I hate my appearance so much there would be no point anyway. Oh I am sorry, I know that when women become mothers appearance and "superficial stuff" don't matter at all since we don't care about anything else than our children's welfare. If we do, it is just to please our husbands. Well, I don't have a husband, and I mourn the loss of my looks very much. It affects my self esteem.
I am perfectly aware how society even the most feminist, free countries in the world sees single mothers. I am a fuck up, a mess up, I was "pumped and dumped", I deserve this. No good man wants me anymore. I have lost even the boys who used to be my friends, not to mention when my boyfriend left us absolutely no one was interested in me anymore.
I spend my days with my little human. I take care of her, I feed her, I bathe her, I play with her, I go to the park with her, I read to her. I am constantly, absolutely constantly, scared of parenting her wrong. I try to learn about parenting methods which I can't seem to really keep up with in real life.
Now, let's get to the important part of my mindless, long rambling: I love her. With all my heart. I have short times of immense joy with her. My life is for her. I am trying to get into university in a field that would have 9-16 days so I can construct my life around her. I will fight with everything I have to ensure she has a good life.
If I was sent to that day right now, holding my phone with shaking hands, convinced I have to cancel my abortion, would I still do it? No. I wouldn't. I would abort.
People don't like extremely complicated answers, answers that actually reflect life that is hard and has a million different view points. They want "oh not aborting was the most wonderful decision of my life, my child gave me a reason and happiness and everything". They don't want young women with no realistic opportunities to support themselves without the help of the government to have children, but will judge those who abort.
If I could, I would go back and abort in a heart beat, actually understanding what it means to stay up alone all by yourself, be left my your boyfriend who has the freedom to just merrily fuck off to his exciting student-life bubble with our old friends. I would understand how taxing the bodily, mental and hormonal changes are. I would understand, than once you have a child that's it. Your life is over, or at least put on on hold, and you never get life or those precious years of freedom, fun, studying and networking back. The reason people make babies in stable marriages is because parenting is FUCKING HARD. It is FUCKING EXHAUSTING. I would give anything in this world to do this when I am significantly older, with a supporting husband, living our on own money, in house. It would be wonderful to have that now, but still it wouldn't be what I really want in life. It would still be a second-place good.
I don't need help, or reassuring, or cheering or "it will be get better when that baby reaches age x"-thing. Nor I am looking for compassion. I know clear well my post comes off as a selfish, whining bitch. That's how women are seen. We have a motherhood myth, and if you don't fit in you are a monster. I don't need advice or "why don't you just adopt/quit bitching and enjoy what you have/at least you have a healthy child/most people have it worse". I don't give a fuck. I know perfectly well I am a good mom and will be a good mom, and I will do everything for her. However I don't like it, I don't like my life. Its lost.
I have been to the doctor and yes I am depressed. I don't need "this is your post natal depression speaking, it will get better when you get sleep, when she is an adult you are grateful for her blah blah, you would be depressed anyway". I don't believe depression being an illness that just pops out randomly for no reason at all. I am depressed because I hate my life and have no way out, and the reason it is because I hate being a mother. You can reverse every single thing in life except having kids and death.
TL;dr: Women who are pregnant and thinking whether or not to abort: Do not give a single fuck for any outside opinion. Not the opinion of your boyfriend, or even husband, relative, friend, church member, whatever (I know the husband and boyfriend-part will trigger a massive roar, don't care.) . Look at your life in the future, what you want, and then act accordingly. Keep your child ONLY if you WANT TO BE A MOTHER. Everything else, finances, relationships, people shaming and guilt-tripping you, is bullshit. I am not encouraging anyone to abort. I am saying that in the end no one else will be there, and it will be you and only you, with your one, unique life. It needs to be your decision you know you can live with the rest of your life. Those people wanting to influence you are not going to care or help you in the end.
Edit: I have to go now and it can take me a long time until I get back (I can't be on phone or computer when I am with my kid) , so I am upset I can't answer to each and every post made here, but. Please know that all your positive messages have made a huge impact on me. I am in tears. I shared something painful and instead of a few trolls and ignoring, I got to have so encouraging and beautiful messages and other women sharing their feelings and life situations. I thank all of you for your PMS (except the trolls) and your messages. I will read all of them and try to answer to as much as I can.
And to that person who gave me gold, I have no words. Just... Thank you. Thank you so much.
Quick edit 2 since this is important: I would never say to my daughter that she wasn't really wanted, and I will do everything I can ever to feel the complete opposite. I will never tell her anything what really happened when I considered my options. I've always said to her I loved you since the moment I knew you were coming and that she is my greatest gift, and those things are true. My daughter is the light of my life, and I don't blame her on anything, what I do blame is myself and wish that women could have more support. I know my feelings are more complex than mothers are allowed to have, but to those asking if I hate my daughter that is the last sentiment I have. I will be the best I can for her, and I am sticking to my decision.
Edit 3 : Good god I am shaking. I don't understand what is happening here. I am honestly in a state of shock. I thought I would just quickly check this before crashing since I can hardly keep my eyes open, and came back to blown up inbox of hundreds of messages, four fucking golds, this is being in the /sub/all. I can't wrap my head around what is happening.
Your messages. Your private messages. It would be impossible for me to try to put in words how I am feeling right now. It would be too little to say that I am overwhelmed. I have read message after message with my hand covering my mouth since I can't take all these people reaching out to me, telling their stories and sharing how they feel about their situations that are from every perspective of this issue, people sending just LOVE, just lovely, encouraging, loving messages for a complete stranger (and yes so, so many hateful trolls too, btw I don't read further immediately when I spot on a message that was mean simply to hurt). I don't know what to do with all this love. My heart is beating so fast.
It would be absolutely impossible for me to go through all of them right now, it is very late and I have spend much longer on this than I really could. I will read each and every single of them and reply to as many as I possibly can.
I can't believe just letting the world see my ugly raw hopelessness and feelings of being trapped could open a gate like this. I dwell on these thoughts hour to hour, day to day alone, month to month, usually when grandma takes my daughter to her so I can have a short break I write to myself in my diary. I can't believe the amount of women reaching out and sharing how they feel.
As I said, I am not religious, but I believe in the universe. But let's just say I've have a very hard couple of months, and extremely hard couple of days, especially this day. i think. I think I was supposed to write this. Something has cracked inside of me, I can't handle my emotions right now but this, this has been more therapeutic than the 7 months I have spent with a professional. I know this sounds ridiculous, but this is some kind of turning point for me. I feel it.
I don't know how to say thank you. Thank you. Just thank. you. Thank you, thank you, thank you. Now I am going to drink about 6 liters of water to hydrate myself after all this crying and then I think I am going to lay down to the bed and be actually able to breath without the heavy feeling of creeping pain and soul-crushing anxiety blocking it. Then I am going to sleep well. For the first time in so long I don't want to write it. I just know it.
Since I have this one short chance to say how I feel about this and maybe reach out to someone (also because I received so many of those messages of how I promote and encourage abortion), I will repeat this in a shorter way: Nothing else matters than your own, personal, deep desire and inner voice on choosing what to do. It has to be YOUR choice. Do it ONLY if it TRULY is YOUR choice. Nothing else should do, since nothing else really matters. Everything and everyone trying to manipulate, influence, bully, shame, or convince you is indifferent. It should go without saying, but since it was confusing to so many people, this applies to those women wanting to keep your baby but feeling that you are too much of x, have too much or too less of x or are being pushed by a partner/parent/important person in your life to abort. That decision will hurt you, greatly.
Let's get through this one more time: your marital status, age, education, wealth, what the society and community thinks, your image, how religion/someone from the outside views your decision, every single one of those are not what should be the reason you do what you do. "But women are struggling to conceive so I should feel lucky, but my married lover wants me to abort, but I have everything I need in life, I am ready", do not give a single fuck if it goes against your inner voice. If it comes from the outside, it is not yours, and you will have more than a hard time living life that is not yours. If it is, you will find a way to cope with everything and anything that comes along the way, since nothing in life is a greater motivation, source of power than knowing what you are doing comes from you.
And lastly for those attacking me for bringing up the pro-life propaganda and how much it affected me, being skeptical about how it can get through to someone like me: when you are a confused hadly-an-adult, in a situation that is so panicking you feel like you are in the roof of a burning apartment with no opportunities to save yourself, with a huge hormonal rush, not knowing what to do (or more like thinking you aren't supposed to do what you want to do), you submit to powers you would normally not pay a second to. And I consumed that shit a lot. I understand it is hard to understand for an outsider, but when you are in a state of complete vulnerability feeling like it is something too big for you to decide, it is easier to listen to someone who says they know exactly what is right for you even if you know it isn't. They use stuff that cuts down to your emotions and really fucks up your mind.
I am not blaming my boyfriend, my internet habits, or anyone outside for my decision. I take full responsibility of what happened. No one forced me with a gun to do anything, even though it felt like it in some way. But just like it was my choice, I should have seen it truly is only my choice and absolutely no one is invested in that I am.
And that is my goal for women to realize. I belive we are strong together and should celebrate and look out for each other. Womanhood is a beautiful but hard thing and we need to help each other. Thank you, you wonderful ladies and gentlemen. I will get back to all of you soon.
Thank you for giving me hope, since that is what I got from this. Hope. So much hope. I am now going to bed with a lighter heart I've had in years.
Thank you for your post. You do a really great job of showing the complicated, non-black-and-white life we live.
Your perspective is really valuable. I'm going to keep in mind your words when/if I have to make the choice between abortion and motherhood. I had a pregnancy scare a while back, and although I was pretty determined to have an abortion, I still felt so conflicted about how other people would feel. If I ever have to go through that again, I know what I would choose. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.
As a girl who grew up with a mother who didnt want to be a mother, I believe and agree with everything you say wholeheartedly.
1) Your English is actually really good, so I just wanted to let you know that.
2) I appreciate your honesty, and if any haters/trolls come around, please just ignore them. These are the conversations we need to be having about the subject matter--- honest, open ones, no matter what our personal beliefs are (and thank you for starting said conversation).
For your child's sake...Print every picture you can get of him in other countries, travelling, spending, etc.
He should pay child support, regardless of his involvement. He should also pay health insurance.
The "3rd party" is your child and she deserves to have all her resources.
From the article is was the Taliban that sent them back to the stone ages.
Pretty sure the US backed Mujahideen attacking the Soviet-Afghan regime which was actively educating girls had something to do with it.
CIA, Saudi Arabia & Pakistans ISI funded the Taliban.
Violence against women and girls in the form of physical, psychological, and sexual abuse remains prevalent. Afghan women and girls are often forced into marriages with older men, resulting in alarming suicide rates. In 2007 alone, 500 women set fire to themselves to escape forced marriages.
Can someone explain to me why compare these two numbers? What do they have to do with one another? Why not compare road accidents or work place fatalities? Why would you use one set of statistics of deaths to trivialise other statistics of deaths? Does the fact more people die in accidents every year that women die from domestic violence over ten years make either any less serious?
Can someone explain to me why compare these two numbers?
It’s about perspective. A lot of people are losing their shit about terrorism, but just going by the numbers we obviously have far bigger fish to fry.
It’s also apt to point out when Trump’s proposed budget includes cuts to the Department of Health and Human Services (which have programs to assist domestic violence victims) while increasing military spending.
From the article sourced:
"So the total deaths from Sept. 11 and the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan is a maximum of 9,838. It’s lower when we exclude non-American victims on Sept. 11."
"Another tally, this one from a 2013 U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics report, shows 10,470 women killed in intimate partner homicides from 2002 to 2010. (That tally should be higher, too, because it does not account for the 3.5 months that followed Sept. 11, 2001.)" [Where are you getting the 11,766 figure from?]
While 10,470 is certainly still higher than 9,838, it's a far cry from over double. What statistics are you using to make this claim?
But this is the problem, if you go by the numbers they don't say much at all when compared. There are orders of magnitude more couples in America than there are soldiers in active combat or terrorists carrying out successful attacks.
The difference in magnitude and kind between the two types of crime being compared directly without any mention of a rate or accounting for other variables seems to be a deliberate attempt to obscure perspective rather than provide it.
I think the freedom to dress in any way you choose is one of the ultimate forms of feminism
It is. Some people seem to confuse the pressure women receive to dress a certain way with choosing for themselves and coming to the same outfit choice. We're fighting a lack of choice, not a lack of clothing.
Or men, hopefully.
It sounds like three idiots nobody cares about tweeted calling her a hypocrite, and like 48 million tweeted in support of her. Don't really see how this is a "controversy".
My son's flag football team played an all-girls team. I learned a few things.
My son (10) is playing flag football and his team is not good. So I get to the field and see something odd; is that girls team playing against us?
I was blown away right off the bat. Was there something wrong? What is going on? I've never ever seen an all girls team playing boys in a kids sports league.
Parents around the field (on our side and even passerbys) seemed to have the same thoughts.
My dad was visibly annoyed. "This is going to be unfair!" he laughed. "Damn liberals!"
And so the game went on and it became very clear; the girls were good. In flag football, at ages 8-10, physical toughness means almost nothing. Most plays are interceptions or running plays. The quarterbacks aren't that great and there is no blocking. So all you need to succeed is positioning (aided by the coach on the field) and being quick. To be fair there are really skilled players, but not many.
So the game went on and my son's team lost by 4-5 touchdowns. We ended up throwing 3 interceptions in a row. It was a slaughter.
My dad and others on our side were annoyed. My dad openly mocked (in a light way) my son. "You got beat by girls!" he laughed. The team looked really sad. As we walked away I heard a random dad on the sideline gleefully telling his friend that a girl team just beat a boy team.
But then I saw the parents of the girls who were next to our parents. I watched them and saw this deep, deep pride. I saw it in the coach of the girl's team. They were so damn happy that their girls were able to kick some ass. I honestly wanted to give them all hugs. Because the parents heard the underhand comments of the NFL dads on the sidelines. They heard the jokes. But they just wanted to watch some football and cheer on their kids.
That night I was not able to turn off my brain. "You've failed your son." "He is going to be mocked for the rest of his life." "But maybe he is okay.. it isn't a big deal." "But if that happened when I was a young boy I'd be laughed at for ever."
Fast forward to the next day and I take my son to get some mexican food and I casually brought up the night before. And telling him how I felt (a mix of pride in the girls team, that girls around the world have never been able to do certain things because people didn't let them, that men and even women will say girls can't do things, but that their are differences in ability in men and women (you'll never see a woman beating a world champion male MMA fighter for example), but that at a certain age and for certain sports there is no difference)... but after I told him it I could tell it wasn't even a big deal for him. He shrugged and said, "Ya they were good. Our team sucks. No big deal."
And then it hit me. Because I've raised my son honestly and without prejudice (the best I can), because he wasn't brought up in a world of over-the-top sexism and because he is just fucking smart (sorry, gotta brag) he already knew what I told him. He was already over it. To him it was just a better team beating his team because they had a better coach and had a better game.
Now looking back I think this will be a positive experience for him. He saw the ugliness of the world (the parents, the societal feeling that men are ALWAYS stronger than girls) and at the same time he saw the beauty (that you should wait to judge people based on their actions, girls and boys aren't monolithic creatures, sometimes you win and sometimes you lose, being better means playing better).
Tldr: adults are the problem, kids don't give a fuck unless you tell them they should
"Ya they were good. Our team sucks. No big deal."
Real as fuck. This kid doesn't mess around. Game recognizes game.
Sports parents are usually a problem regardless of who's playing.
there is LITTLE difference between 8-10 year old boys and 8-10 year old girls. Neither group has gone through puberty yet, and the girls are more likely to reach it before the boys.
Girls in that age range are more mature, dexterous and coordinated than boys.
I think that most parents know these things right? The hormonal changes that decide strength, speed and size occur during puberty.
edit: changed "no Difference" to "little difference" because people would rather nitpick than understand the obvious point. Congrats!
Sounds like my mom. I got pregnant at 18 and abortion was the first words out of her mouth. She paid for it and drove me there. Now that I'm 35 she is anti-abortion to a level that really pisses me off and pressures me to have grandkids.
She goes on to say that what she isn't OK with is the "liberal position" of wanting abortion to be accessible to "anyone, anytime, anywhere."
So who is to dictate who is worthy of an abortion in her opinion if it is to not be accessible to anyone, anytime, or anywhere? It seems as if she's under the impression that abortion is like a form of birth control to women and it's done willy nilly without careful thought from the mother and her healthcare provider.
There's a great quote I read in this sub once. It was something like:
Some people feel women want an abortion like they want a Porsche or an ice cream cone when the reality is women want an abortion the same way an animal wants to gnaw off its own leg to escape a trap.
Why can't we just come to the conclusion that this is a difficult personal decision that individuals other than family and healthcare providers should simply stay out of?
So much about this is familiar. I was 16 and at first I wanted to have the baby. Now that I'm 32 and about to get my PhD I'm so glad I didn't! But she cries and guilts herself (and me) for "pressuring me," when what she did was explain the reality of the situation to my 16-year-old brain and then I made the right decision.
And yeah I've had to shut her down as recently as yesterday for pressuring me to have kids.
I've always said that I wish someone would have done that with me. Actually sat me down and explained how my life was about to change, that I'd never live with roommates and get to do what I please. I'd never get to just pick up and go travel or anything like that. I love my son, but my family's code of silence is kind of how I ended up pregnant in the first place.
Over 100,000 Iranian women took to the streets to protest compulsory Hijab in 1979. Look at Iran now.
Fuck, that's terrifying and disgusting.
I'm one of the lucky ones that had a clot and consequently a stroke so I guess you could say I have mixed feelings about it. I know it's super unlikely, especially the kind I had where the clot actually formed in my brain so I didn't have the same warning signs. I'm all for pharmacist provided with a good consult like doctors are supposed to, but hesitant about totally OTC no consult necessary. Not really against it, but I'd worry even more people would be unaware of the symptoms that could prevent them from getting a full on stroke even if they start forming clots.
Edit: I didn't expect this to blow up - but hey just look up the symptoms and be an informed BC user...that's all I want!