Wikipedia admin quits over deletion of Cultural Marxism article: "it's painfully obvious now the agenda-driven cliques are more interested in playing politics than actually making an encyclopedia"
Unfortunately this means there is one less person in power interested in academic and fact driven articles and not PoV pushing by cliques who describe themselves as a "consensus." Wikipedia is truth by consensus of users with zero credibility or field experience, not verifiable facts or credible people.
You don't need to know a thing about any subject, just know how to abuse wiki policies and be friends with power users.
Admins userspace deleted articles all the time.
But I guess you're not allowed to touch their little crusade to remove an article. This is the first time I've see unilateral undoing of article userfication, and they're so pissed at they want to remove his admin tools by accusing him of being a KiA / 8chan user.
So wait, being a user of a certain forum is enough to discredit someone? Doesn't Ryulong have posts on Gamerghazi? I'll be waiting wikipedia for his swift removal/s
The fuck? It's licensed under CC and he has authority over his own userspace, no? It looks like they're just bullying him (and won, unless it blows up in PR).
That happened seven years ago or so when the deletionists won. AFD "consensus" was declared in favor of deletion on any topic they found frivolous, despite being massively outvoted and outargued.
accusing him of being a KiA / 8chan user
This is perhaps the most worrying thing - off wiki activity is irrelevant, but this shows a definite corruption and agenda being pushed.
"there's no such thing as cultural marxism!", says the self-proclaimed marxist.
Don't look behind the curtain.
When the deletionists won their battle, I gave up on Wikipedia. Sure I'll occasionally link to it, but only when I can verify that the link hasn't been hit by a bunch of deletionists who think that there is a vast body of knowledge which is, for some reason, just irrelevant.
I find it amusing that the railfan Wikipedia pages are immune to deletionists, because they document, in excruciating, ridiculous, detail, every last thing there is to know about every locomotive that has ever been made, and locomotives are actual physical artifacts so they're as notable as a notable thing could possibly be. Meanwhile, the Pokemon pages are a nuclear wasteland, because who would possibly care about that bit of nonsense?
The downfall of Wikipedia is from GamerGate, I love it.
Let their bullshit come to light hoist it hoist it to the public eye, lay witness to their hypocrisy and weep.
You do know that regular people don't give a shit about any of this right? They don't know what gamergate is, don't know about the crap going on at Wikipedia and quite frankly they don't care.
No real downfall here - just the shit is being dragged into light, downfall would be if there were alternatives to a major site like wiki. I for once would like to see actual academic institutions represented and mod and admin rights in hands of people that can be trusted with such a task instead of random people from the internet. Both universities I have attended (UK and Netherlands) automatically fail people for using wikipedia as a source so their academic reputation is already long gone.
Consensus is giving way to democratic centralism.
I think he means that users are free to backup deleted articles and that some admins do it. I'm fairly certain you're allowed to have whatever you want as drafts on your user space provided it doesn't violate "BLP" (derogatory to living persons) offensive stuff like ASCII dicks
Ryulong has an article called "List of Monsters" in some weeaboo show or some bullshit with a more than 1000 entries that just looks like his personal data base for his own use rather than intended to be on the actual site
For new people, this is in reference to
"After bewildered complaints, Wales restored the original page and asked for an extra week’s debate on the sudden and drastic shift, sparking outrage from a cabal of editors who favored the change. Whether the change will win out will be determined less by truth and more by the stubbornness and comparative popularity of the editors and the administrators backing them." -Auerbach in slate article.
I'm glad I'm a cheapskate and will never donate to Wikipedia. Not ever. Fuck this Goebbels shit.
Yeah that makes sense. As long as you have a section of the Frankfurt School page that explains the "cultural marxism" idea neutrally.
They I've just checked and they have it under "conspiracy theory". That phrase honestly needs to be banned from wikipedia.
What was the big deal about him moving it to his userspace? Why was it against policy to do that? Wouldn't it be a good idea? Aren't users sometimes encouraged to make articles in their userspace to show other editors how an article could look, to be more worthy as an article standing on its own?
With all the stuff that Reddit campaigns for all the time, wouldn't this be something to care for?
Making this information about what's happening available to people and maybe sending emails to professors and scholars around the world for added effect will help.
It would be a shame to lose Wikipedia to politics as well.
Ryolong never denied being a pedophile.
Oh, looks like the Frankfort school conspiracy theory page is now just a redirect as well. Is Rgloucester an admin? If so what is the policy on NPOV for admins?
He has a specific hardon for erasing anything to do with cultural marxism.
Edit: Not an admin, just friends with some.
Because I have nothing better to do over Christmas vacation than play wikilawyer.
Being friends with admins is the same as being an actual admin.
Wait, did Ryulong ever deny the allegations of raping and murdering that girl in 1990? I almost forgot about that kerfuffle.
Last time I posted a link to this sub,
"take this gamergame shit elsewhere"
"You have been banned from (subreddit)"
This is why the UN is so dysfunctional. You get a bunch of tyrannical overlords to vote on stuff and you're going to get stupid shit like that.
I believe there's articles on the New World Order, the Patriarchy, 9/11 truthers, the anti-vax movement, chemtrails, etc. As there should be. It's an encyclopedia.
Both universities I have attended (UK and Netherlands) automatically fail people for using wikipedia as a source so their academic reputation is already long gone.
That doesn't have anything to do with Wikipedia though. You should never cite any encyclopedia as they aren't a primary source.
says the self-proclaimed marxist.
The self-proclaimed cultural Marxist.
I'm wondering this as well. I suspect my "read" on the controversy here is wrong. But it looks to me like they're upset he's trying to preserve the deleted article, which would be ridiculous.
A discussion about "Will Wikipedia have an article about every single Pokemon or just that many."
Applies to everything else, but for video games it is being applied especially strictly.
And this is why i don't donate
Crazy! Now when you type in cultural marxism it references "frankfurt school" with the only reference to cultural marxism is a little blurb at the end under "conspiracy theories".
they then reference it to the tea party movement and a conservative think tank.
what a excellent way to discredit the entire word. such a shame
When the deletionists won their battle, I gave up on Wikipedia.
Pardon my ignorance, but I can only speculate from the name itself. Who were the deletionists and what were their goals?
When the likes of Syria, Cuba, and North Korea end up on a Human Rights committee, it becomes a joke.
Well, democratic centralism just means that whatever the vote turns out, everyone involved must give unqualified support to the winning side. If you don't, then you are to be purged.
It is a good idea and it probably wasn't actually against any policy. In fact, his reaction wasn't a bad one. However, the people messing with the article got pissed at him for trying to tamper with their "work." I'm sure it wasn't this one isolated event that caused him to leave, either. People mess with articles to fit their agenda all the time, and this event could have just been the straw that broke the camel's back.
Admins userspace deleted articles all the time.
Can you cite this?
Yeahh I'm kinda happy I didn't donate to Wikipedia after all. Wales seems to care more about his PI than helping the general public.
Honestly I don't think the article had enough coverage to justify more than a section in the Frankfurt School article. But that's not what this is about. Dude was just trying to retrieve the article history, which he had every right to do. Frankly, I agree with the resigned admin that this shows the people trying to remove the article in the first place were using WP to play politics. It shows that they push for the same outcome regardless of whether it's justified.
People might not care about gamergate, but they care about wikipedia being reliable to an extend.
Absolute veto power is basically the only thing that has kept the UN relevant and not turning to complete shit.
If he denied raping and murdering a woman, he would only be proving that he indeed is a rapist! Because if the situation with Max Temkin have taught us anything about rape accusations, is you aren't supposed to defend yourself against them
Check the choice of words on the Rape Culture page:
Rape culture is a theoretical concept...
There you have it. If an article about a theoretical (and totally absurd) concept can be left on, I don't see how they can justify deleting the Cultural Marxism page.
I'll play devil's advocate here, because I'm good at it:
At the end of the day, wasn't "cultural Marxism" a critique of a set of philosophical/censorship practices? If so, why shouldn't it be included on the page for the original idea --IE "The Frankfurt School."
It doesn't strike me as something like the Men's Rights movement. It isn't as though there is a dedicated "anti-cultural Marxist" movement right? So, it makes sense if Feminism and Men's Rights get different pages, but "cultural marxism" just seems like a critique of another set of ideas.
I found the original page, which was a mess anyway (I assume because its edit history was so politically motivated). I get the argument that the articles should be condensed.
I think Logan_Mac and dwaven and others have been doing great work keeping Wikipedia craziness in the open. That's a very good thing IMHO. I gather that fair number of good folks on the inside have been trying to fight the good fight against SJW politicization of Wikipedia. Sure sounds like this has been on the whole a losing battle ... as in the Gamergate article. All the more reason that it's important that the information about what's going on be somehow documented & gotten out. Documenting today even losing battles may provide some kind of basis for renewed battles in the future, whether on the inside or outside of Wikipedia. So please whoever's involved keep documenting and getting out what's going on.
Any sense of actually having a debate is blown to pieces when you find out the editors arguing for deletion aren't doing so because of actual Wiki policies but for controlling a narrative and rewriting history. I'm sick of having to defend articles on people I would usually hate in real life, hell I'm Argentine and Che Guevara is big here, leftist ideas are the norm in South America (they're not as crazy and fucking pretentious as in the US, sorry folks), but I'm not going to erase an article simply because it's bashing what I think. I even found the idea of Cultural Marxism a bit silly since the beginning and it sounds like a /pol/ thing, but it has an argument, and it exists.
Oh, looks like the Frankfort school conspiracy theory page is now just a redirect as well.
This seems to be an improvement. The conspiracy theory is no longer given WP:UNDUE weight by getting a separate lengthy article.
Some Untouchables decided Cultural Marxism (a concept that existed for decades) was a construction by Gamergate (not even 6 months old) and decided to do everything in their power to kill the idea.
Untouchables are wikipdia admins who have other admins for friends, so they create an iron curtain of admins and editors to push whatever they want. They are well versed in the bureaucratic mess that makes the encyclopedia 'work.' Spread the word on how shitty Wiki has become.
Who was the POS mod that did that?
The self-proclaimed Marxist who isn't interested in economics. Can't make this shit up.
I'd also like to point out that Marxism is to Cultural Marxism as Darwinism is to Social Darwinism. An important distinction IMO.
Archive of cached Cultural Marxism Wiki pages. 6 October, 2014 shows the additions of "Use by 21st Century US Conservatives" and "Allegations of Antisemitism." 4 November, 2014 show the removal of mention of the Frankfurt and Birmingham schools. The farther back you go, the more objective the page gets. This is very troubling, but unlike book-burning you can't just erase things from the internet.