Muslim 'peace march' held in Germany but turnout disappoints

Muslim 'peace march' held in Germany but turnout disappoints
Muslim 'peace march' held in Germany but turnout disappoints

The original post hit the front page with 50k upvotes. They predicted 10000 and got only 300 in attendance. lol

The country's biggest Islamic association had refused to take part in the march. The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem.

Yeah, if you take a stance against extremism within your own culture, it's somehow sending the wrong message./s

For a better contrast:

About 5.000 muslims demonstrated in Germany shortly after the release of the Muhammad caricature that later led to the "Charlie Hebdo" terrorist attack.[edit]

It's worth mentioning that the DITIB is a german pro-Erdogan organisation financed by Erdogans party, last year they organized a 40.000-50.000 people pro-Erdogan rally in cologne, this week they told turks in germany that they should not attend the anti-extremism rally...

tl;dr

ERDOGAN CAN GO SUCK A BIG OLD DONKEY DICK

This is exactly why extremism is flourishing. First, you have to admit you have a problem...

The funny thing is that the article never specified "who" expected "up to 10k". It's strongly implied that it's the organizers or someone credible, but there were no direct quotes from someone on the 10k figure. This is the "real" fake news. Not 100% bullshit stories on tiny blogs. It's large publications using weasel words, adjectives, emphasizing certain aspects to a story while downplaying others that allows them to craft a narrative that's completely detached from the truth.

I could say "my net worth might increase by $200million this week" because I bought a lotto ticket, but that's still deception in practice.

It's far more prevalent than we'd like to believe. Here, have you heard the sad story about how a Syrian Migrant Dies in German Blast?

When I read the first article and saw that it was just a prediction I was like... yeah, I'll wait for the actual march.

Vocalized their anger about the cartoon.

So the independent was lying when they said it was 10,000 strong?

Demonstrated for what, though?

Edit: Yep, it's been explained to me guys. I'm honestly angered by it.

suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem

Isn't it something like 90% of all terrorist attacks worldwide are committed by islamic extremists (mostly against members of other sects of Islam)?

If Muslims are the primary perpetrators and victims, does that not make it "mainly a Muslim problem"?

This speaks volumes.

I wish I could say I'm surprised but I'm really not.

Since 2013, I've traveled to a handful of Muslim-majority and regions. I've visited Bosnia & Herzegovina, Turkey, Bahrain, the UAE, Qatar, Kazakhsthan, India's Jammu & Kashmir, and the northern reaches of Iraq.

Everyone I've gone in the Muslim world, I've been greeted with an unimaginable hospitality. Welcoming guests is a core part of Turkish and Arab culture, speaking broadly, and I was never made to feel uncomfortable or unwanted.

However, I did notice a lot of people espousing a lot of opinions and explaining perspectives which seemed directly at odds with my own take on the world. People in rural Turkey would shout out "Heil Hitler!" when they found out a traveling companion was from Germany, or make jokes about how they wish they Fuhrer had 'finished the job.'

In Srinagar, I saw spraypaint welcoming the Taliban into Kashmir, and met cohorts of college-educated Egyptians in New Delhi who thought homosexuality was a mortal sin and should be outlawed.

I have nothing against the individual Muslim, but I've lost the feeling I once had that Islam is a religion comprised largely of moderate people. I can still relate to them as human beings, but I do not know if my moral compass and philosophy, as well as that of most people in my culture, can relate to theirs.

About as disappointing as the turn out to my Garage Sale this morning. Hour and a half and still no one.

I wonder if this is going to get 7000 comments too.

Feels>Reals for reddit

Careful. He'll set his bodyguards on you.

"The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem."

Wow. How long can they continue to live in denial?

Not saying all arabs are muslims and vice versa, but if there is one thing we arabs are good at it's being late or not attending at all lmao.

No, organizers said they expected 10k, so independent reported that number, obfuscating the fact that it was just an estimation. Now they'll probably report an inflated number and call it a success, with a cursory mention of the estimatioms, if that.

Arab here, I can confirm this. We follow "Arabic standard time", which translates to "always late unless there is free food".

Independent publishes trash all the time now, I wish people would stop upvoting their posts on worldnews.

I heard an interview on the radio with the woman who organized the March and she sounded pretty optimistic about there being more than 10000 attendees.

The "Canadian Rally for Trump" had more attendees. Seeing as that event held 9/10 of the positions on /sub/all when it had a small turnout, I am sure this story will be equally popular with Reddit.

Sad and telling about the situation.

Islam is incompatible with western values of women's rights, free speech, freedom of religion, freedom of the press, And basic human decency.

Just to clarify

The country's biggest Islamic association had refused to take part in the march. The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem. It also said Muslims observing the Ramadan fast couldn't be expected to march for hours in summer temperatures.

The country's biggest Islamic association had refused to take part in the march. The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem. It also said Muslims observing the Ramadan fast couldn't be expected to march for hours in summer temperatures.

another 50.000 demonstrated FOR Erdogan last year

I went back and checked, and it doesn't even say who expects "up to 10k". This is misleading journalism at its worst.

according to pew research Islamic extremism is a majorly supported opinion.

Just not so much the ISIS way, not that the % that support them isn't way to high for comfort.

If they love Turkey so much and hate infidels, maybe they should all be deported

Turkish person here (unfortunately living in Turkey) and how I wish that would happen. That scum living in Europe, being treated like human beings yet support Erdogan for Turkey from afar... I guarantee they'd do a complete 180 if there was a threat of deportation. They act like victims and talk like "if Erdogan was ruling Turkey in 80s - 90s we'd never have to come and live in Europe" or similar but its all lies. They would never come back and live in Turkey; they love what Europe provides for them. Fucking hypocrites.

Had a muslim friend who was late to everything.

Called him "9/12".

It doesn't matter; you can make a fake article and get a shit tonne of clicks and attention. The correction will get 1/50 of the attention, and then most people will believe the false report is accurate.

The writer will get a pat on the back for bringing in a bunch of clicks, it doesn't matter if what they were writing was fake.

I don't like the fact the vast majority do not accept gay marriage.

The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem.

...But it is mainly a muslim problem. They need to fix it.

Fortunately for me, I'm in a country that wouldn't tolerate that shit

The woman who organised the march is Lamya Kaddor. She had some interviews this week where she claimed that 10.000 might attend (link(german)). Also, while you are free to demonstrate here in germany, a demonstration and its size has to be registered with the police, which is also a source how many people were expected.

You sellin a panini press? I'd love a cheap panini press.

This doesn't surprise me in the least. I lived with a muslim guy for a few month, he was hospitable and warm in many ways, however, he held some strong beliefs totally at odds with the west.

It's not unbelievable to me that someone can be polite and also totally against your culture/who you are.

Against freedom of speech.

I don't have any for Germany, but I do have one for Britain. It was a protest against Charlie Hebdo (the organisation).

Thousands of British Muslims gathered near Downing Street yesterday to protest against the public...

Outside Downing Street, protesters held banners and signs with the words “Charlie and the abuse factory” and “learn some manners”on them.

A series of Muslim leaders addressed the crowd from a platform outside the Ministry of Defence, with the message “Be careful with Muhammad”.

The protest was organised by the Muslim Action Forum, which said that the Charlie Hebdo cartoons had helped “sow the seeds of hatred” and had damaged community relations.

The leaflet said: “The recent re-publishing of the cartoons, caricatures and depictions of the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) by Charlie Hebdo magazine and other publishers is a stark reminder that freedom of speech if regularly utilised to insult personalities that others consider sacred.

“Such actions are deliberating insulting and provoking to Muslims worldwide as British citizens, we believe that these publications will continue to ‘sow the seeds of hatred’ and damage community relations.

It comes weeks after two terrorists attacked the offices of Charlie Hebdo, the Paris-based satirical magazine which had published images of the Prophet Muhammad, killing 12 staff and wounding 11 others.

Lamya Kaddor

I just wikipedia'd her and currently lmao. She is known for introducing islamic education to public schools in germany, and atleast five of her former students became jihadists.

More people showed up to do yoga on Parliament Hill that day, lol.

doesnt work in germany though, 5 minuten vor der Zeit ist des deutschen Pünktlichkeit.

If it was a pro-Trump march that got a poor turnout, this would be gilded x40 and at the top of /sub/all

A lot of family members who grew up close to Muslims (but are of a different religion) are always saying that the West still hasn't fully understood what Islam is and how it is fundamentally incompatible with liberalism. Now, however, Westerners are becoming less welcoming... and rightly so, in my personal opinion. A lot of Muslim people are pretty awesome and nice, but when people who have grown up completely differently and with different values and ways of life, it is very difficult to convince them to adjust to a whole other type of society.

The goddamn BBC infuriates me, and I have no clue how the British people don't riot over it. They titled an article "Three Palestinians killed in Jerusalem" when three jihadis attacked and murdered a female Israeli police officer.

The country's biggest Islamic association had refused to take part in the march. The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem.

I don't know how you can honestly argue that. I don't have the numbers in front of me, but I'd bet if you took every single terrorist attack across the globe over the past 20 years upwards of 80% of them will have been in the name of radical Islam.

When a third of muslims think leaving the religion is deserving of death I'd stay indoors and away from this march too. They're the crazy ones blowing people up. Isis blowing up a peace march seems fitting in a way

P-Propaganda! /s.

This thread is full of stupid excuses. Its sad and hilarious at the same time.

My family moved from Iran to the US when I was young. Spent some of my teens going back there to reconnect with my culture. Last time I went back was in 2006, and have no interest of ever returning.

Honestly the whole region/culture is a cesspool and just getting worse. Dont get me wrong, there are some very beautiful and wonderful people/places/things over there, but the social and political stuff is just not compatible with my values.

It really infuriates me when western liberals want to make excuses or pretend like something isnt happening. There is a lot of intolerance over there, and yes, amongst western muslims too. My immediate family is pretty relaxed, but I have extended family and family friends who, quite frankly, dont belong here and need their ass shipped back. They can be very intolerant people, and theyll talk shit behind closed doors (against blacks, gays, jews etc) and then leave it to beaver in public (appearances are very important in islamic cultures).

Im not saying all muslims are a problem, just that they have major hurdles to overcome that they refuse to even acknowledge. And yes, I know christians or other western groups can be just as bad, but people like that dont get a pass like libs like to give to muslims.

The guys from DITIB are pretty disgusting, they're basically trying to establish an Erdogan-run state within a state.

There was one in Chechnya that also protested Charlie Hebdo: Up to 800,000 according to the Guardian.

Just to be clear, they protested the use of the prophet on the cover, not the attack. Also, Chechnya has a population of 1.39 million according to Wikipedia.

Almost no one showed up to this thing. It looked like a Hillary Clinton rally during her campaign.

Turkey

60% in England want homosexuality outlawed altogether.

I cant wrap my head around the idiocy of some people that support islam and also support homosexuality and feminism.

So we have that in common.

This is not a disappointment, this is a backfire. Muslims in the area, including organizations, have now made it utterly clear that combatting terrorism is not a passion or priority for them. Before this flop, that was at least debatable.

Not surprised, the lack of activism in the Muslim world is exactly why the Muslim world lacks activism.

People say 'Not all muslims' which is true. But it's a lot more than people think.

and atleast five of her former students became jihadists.

Yeah.. lets march for peace....

So yes and they also lied about the event already happening.

Oh jeez, I was kind of hoping they'd protest for peace and open-mindedness.

Actually so high hat Pew skewed their own numbers to try to make it look better. When polling Muslims on whether terrorist attacks were justified, they took the "Rarely" responses and included them as "Never" responses.

ever considered they dont see it as a problem, and actually support it?

I always like to bring up that the independent called my fraternity "the worst humans in the world" like a week after ISIS burned some Jordanian pilots alive.

no no no muslims hate terrorism love rights for woman and gays cnn told me so

It is a Muslim problem, and can only be solved by other Muslims. That bullshit excuse was just more bullshit that always comes from Turkey.

The last "march" like that was funded by the two leading parties CDU(Merkel) and SPD which failed as miserably as this one. This march was funded by and I quote "a rich German convert (female)".

Yes, in german.

Am 11. Februar demonstrierten etwa 5000 Muslime in Deutschland friedlich gegen die Darstellung der Karikaturen; der türkische Ministerpräsident Recep Tayyip Erdoğan bot an, in dem Konflikt zu vermitteln.

it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem.

Or it could show that your community supports peace and denounces terrorism, regardless of ethnicity or religious beliefs...

He'll send a whole carful, in fact.

General tourism.

I know many Muslim refugees in the United States, most of whom are either Iraqis or Ahiska Turks from the Russian state of Krasnodar Krai. They're pretty moderate people and gave me a lot of advice for traveling in the Caucasus, Iraqi Kurdistan, and Anatolia.

I'm definitely not guarded when it comes to Muslims - I'm planning to be in Zanzibar in a month and Egypt in three. Like I said, I have no hatred for individual Muslims or their culture. I think Islam is very interesting, but also happen to suspect that its philosophy and jurisprudence, coupled with local cultures, often gives way to less-than-tolerant mindsets.

One thing I have changed is how I approach conversations about religion. People in Muslim-majority countries routinely ask "What religion?" shortly after your name and nationality.

I've completely given up trying to explain that I'm an atheist, or that I've studied Arabic and read the Qur'an without ever being tempted to convert (or, as they might say, 'revert').

A significant portion believe gays should be punished or put to death. Like, 100s of millions significant.

See this is my problem. I dont care if you in your head/home think homosexuality is a sin and dont want to engage with them. That's fine and it's your right. The second you want to take away right from the other it becomes a slippery slope from it being illegal to stick my dick in some guys ass to me getting thrown off a building.

You are correct. That demo was about the Jyllands-Posten caricature. I now edited the original posting.

You are correct. That demo was about the . I now edited the original posting.

Obama wouldn't even name the problem.

Oh so now I'm just "some guy"?

The vast majority literally don't even support gays.

Similar experience. Worked with a Muslim. He was my favorite worker and someone I considered a work friend. He seemed normal and pretty western. After the Charlie Hebdo shooting. I was openly discussing how I thought it was horrible. He was not aware of the situation so I filled him in on it. He casually said something along the lines of well that is what they get for making fun of the prophet. I could tell he really just did not understand why it was wrong. Or he just flat out did not care.

The other Muslim I was friends with was gay. He came to the United States to hide the fact from his parents.

So they made up the estimation? Why even send journalists to take interviews, when you can make up bullshit in your home, and everyone will believe it? Jesus christ the state of modern journalism.

Depends what side you're on I guess. If you grew up in the middle East you'd probably call all the foreigners and their drone attacks terrorists.

It's funny, Erdogan is sucking ransom money from the EU under the threat to letting millions of migrants enter Europe.

"The country's biggest Islamic association had refused to take part in the march. The Turkish-Islamic Union argued it would send the wrong signal by suggesting that international terrorism is mainly a Muslim problem."

Um... it IS mainly a Muslim problem.

This is what happens when you organise a "march by Muslims" without the backing of the most important Muslim group.

Selling anything good?

Yeah OP what you got? List it here.

"Racist" is losing its strength through dilution. If everyone is racist, then no one is racist.

5 minutes before time is the German's punctuality.

(Sounds better when it rhymes).

I'm Irish American. 54 YO. When I was 25, I was asked for money for "the cause", which included car bombings in Northern Ireland. I told the asker to fuck completely off. I have since been mortified to have a violent segment of people contained within my people ever since. Northern Ireland Freedom Fighters (car bombers) can still kiss my Irish ass. With tongue.

That being said, I feel empathic and deeply connected to those believers in Islam who are horrified by the segment of their faith who choose to kill in the name of their "homeland" or "religion" or whatever. Total bullshit.

Stay strong, and keep peacefully loving your neighbors. We believe in you.

Quality journalism

As long as the meek German population lets them.

I think we all follow Arab standard time.

5 minutes early is the German punctual?

Probably holland :)

Im very torn on this. As an atheist I agree that religion and the fanaticism that can follow is the issue. But rather than outright hating an entire group of people, we should look at why it happens. For instance, poverty is great indicator of how religious a community is. This goes for Christianity in America as well.

Again I'm not saying we need to accept these ideals or the fundamentalists and moderates that may enable it, just that we should find better ways of dealing with this rather than ostracization that will only further those extreme beliefs.

Integration folks, let people see that the all mighty dollar is a faith in its own and people will run away from their silly and violent ideals. Works well for the most part in the US.

So I'm drunk and if I'm understanding things correctly, we tried to have a Muslim peace march but Muslims weren't all about it? Well that's sending quite the shitty message isn't it?

I have Muslim friends who are absolutely outstanding people, but this isn't helping their global/social media image.

Feels > Reals is what's caused me to move from far-left to center leaning right in the past year. In some people's minds I'm now "Alt-Right" ffs. It's just absurd and it's popular now (far left views) because people are told it's popular, and are berated if they disagree, not because they're actually good ideas. But damn if they don't make you feel morally superior

As long as the west continues to let feelings dictate their reality they won't have to admit a problem. Most in the west refuse to admit or talk about them being a problem.

I dont hate them, I think the idea that you need religion to be a good person is just stupid.

As for why it happens? Pretty simple, bronze aged belief structure in this day in age. And you are correct, this goes for Catholics and Christions as well.

And no, the idea of falling back to money to help deal with religion does not work. Most of the richest\powerful people are huge supporters of religion in the US and other countries.

Which country

And the huge difference between Christianity and Islam is that for the vast vast majority of Christians, religion is not in any way a big part of their life. Especially for those under the age of ~50.

I know anecdotal evidence isn't in any way an indicator of anything, but as someone who studies in a British college that is 90% Muslim, most young Muslims seem to be against homosexuality, don't believe in evolution, are mildly misogynistic amongst other things.

I used to be a huge defender of Islam, but I've become very disheartened through personal experience.

Ah, but that wasn't because of the Charlie Hebdo caricature and it didn't happened after the attack. This protest took place in 2005, ten years before the Charlie Hebdo attack!

5000? That seem like a lot, do you have any sources? I didn't found anything on google.

Did you even read the original thread? Everybody was shitting on it.