Anyone else have their friends slowly stop playing since 6.83?

Anyone else have their friends slowly stop playing since 6.83?

I've noticed that tons of my friends have sorta just stopped playing since 6.83. A lot of people complained about the rubberband mechanics, or the stale meta, and I think that happens every patch. However what I've noticed is a huge non-vocal group of players just kind of got bored of the game. I think it has to with the fact it's extremely hard for a good player to snowball hard and carry a game unless you're playing troll / jugg / storm / etc. I've noticed that if you snowball hard early, unless you can push high ground solo, there's really not much you can do. It's extremely difficult to play an effective ganker mid or support in pubs. I think this led to more boring pub games, and myself included, have slowly just lost interest in the game. I think that the patch is worse than people think- not because of the complaints, but because of the lack of them. I think a lot of people have just gotten bored and moved on. I would be really interested to see how many players with accounts over a year old have dropped off from playing compared to a similar timespan rolling over the past 2 years.

Friend who is a regular player began to play less and less since the patch hit. As the days went on the steam messages I would get from him became more and more nonsensical and unintelligible. The last time I heard from him was three weeks ago now and the only thing he said was "Ho Ho Ha Ha".

Yea, it happened to me too. I mostly play on the offlane and every game is the same: do well early on, gank and create some space but all of it goes to waste after a couple of kills for the enemy.

i've stopped for a whole month and ive been playing dota for 7 years. this meta is not worth the time. it really is no fun.. ;(

We've never lost interest in a patch this hard.

I just kinda stopped playing ranked, cause im not interested in losing my rank just cause i dont like to play troll or sniper

Sounds like the start of a pretty scary horror movie script to me

Deathball was a couple of matches in pro games because the pros hadn't yet figured out how to counter it. I rarely if ever saw it in pubs.

I've played 6+ games every day, 3 years in a row.

Had a 5 day break playing GTA now, and I'm not looking to come back until next patch.

If I have more than one upvote I will put them all on your comment. Indeed early ganks mean nothing now no matter what you lead only couple of bad initiations and you back to Zero like nothing was happened early game. This patch has a lack of progress so the game is going random right now.

It's not just these heroes that makes this meta horrible, it's a combination of things, and mostly it's the fact that no matter how amazing and good you play the same scenario plays out almost every game. First, You win your lane by applying the minutia of hard learned skills you've cultivated over years of playing and watching professional replays, you utterly humiliate your opponent killing them over and over again, their teammates are even flaming them in all chat. You take over the map, aggressive wards everywhere, you take Roshan uncontested, 30 minutes in, what else to do but push and win the game right? Wrong! You make your high ground push, sniper gets a double kill, two are from people running away from shrapnel and tower shots, suddenly you realize "shit maybe we shouldn't push", okay well let's just sit back and farm then right? Wrong again. Sniper continues to farm, the recent gold spike affords him an S&Y, 20 minutes late sure but no matter. The next time you push their ES has a blink, triple kill, from ES echo slam? Nope, the shrapnel again ticked the last bits of damage. Now you're actually behind in gold, sniper just keeps farming and getting bigger, supports who come within a 1,000 units of him on accident die in 3 hits. Okay, let's just defend high ground like they did we can rubberband their rubberband. But wait, turns out they had a troll the whole time! They move to high ground troll pops ult, everything dies and the game is over... but not really cause they just keep farming until 80 minutes, maxed out items, now it's time to end the game, sniper one shots all your heroes while troll kills the throne in 5 seconds and then you realize that you just wasted 80 god damn minutes of your life only to lose to some scrubs who just auto attacked creeps for 60 minutes than lazily pursued victory because they were out of item slots. That's what 6.83 is all about.

Same here, 7 years in a row and now 1 month without dota

I agree with you. Not 100% sure about my friends, but in my case (me personally), every time I queue some Normal (unranked) matchmaking game to have some fun and, as a result, get a match when enemies pick sniper/troll/jug/allthisshittogether and just go as five since 15-20 min and push towers to the ancient, I just want to close dota and RUN AWAY FROM THIS HO HO HA HA

This so much. And don't tell me about comback, it doesn't feel like one.

Yesterday I played a game where we got kinda crushed early. I had PA and fed 2 kills in the first 2 minutes (including first blood). I got shut down on my lane and couldn't farm (I was the only carry). But yeah, enemies got a couple of bad initiations. I grabbed a couple of kills while farming the jungle (casually walking out to grab low hp targets). At some point I was just too big and we just steamrolled down each lane and won.

And you know what, it felt like shit. We did nothing special, we didn't adapt out playstyle. I don't feel like I did anything to win. After the first 2 kills I gave up I just stood still launching daggers to creeps. I had kinda given up already and went to the jungle in boredom. I didn't even farm that well in the end. Didn't try.

All in all it was a comeback game where I played the big PA that comes back and crits people into oblivion. 6 months ago I would have loved that. But yesterday it was just boring, with a bitter aftertaste on top of that.

I played 1 bot match the other day. Before that I was on a 15 day break.

I don't know if it's the current meta, but I'm not having fun anymore.


I've never played in a patch where I've been so afraid of a single hero pick as much as I am with Troll. I've found myself picking him more and more (I'm not normally a meta-picker) but I just don't want them to have him and none of my allies picked him!

I think pub-dota struggles when the OP heroes from the pro scene are easy to play. Any scrub can play Jugger or Troll or Sniper. When the OP heroes were Invoker, Brew, Tinker or IO it didn't affect the pub scene anywhere near as much since players couldn't utilise them to the full potential anyway.

trust me u dont want that tinker back.

I used to carry my team as a support, roaming/forcing my team to take objectives/picking right item and slowly climbed at RMM. 6.83 is a nightmare for me. The core-meta heroes are too strong and can win games on their own, and my impact seems to be negligible, as I do not play along with meta

Dota 2 player numbers

Its funny that everyone in this thread seems to win his lane.

+1 quitter since the new metas:

early pushing not worth it

ganking not worth it

even more russian-only speakers on english language preference

got to 4k and it's even worse than it was at 2.9k. People used to talk down there.

your team goes full afk / jungle if you dominate mid and gank their jungle solo, enemies start going as 5, kill my afk jungler and voila, advantage lost.

Yep, I'm the same way. I used to play Dota probably 15-20 hours a week. Just checked my dotabuff, last game I played was 8 days ago and the games before that ~ 1 month ago. The game just isn't fun anymore. Troll / Jugg / Sniper / Axe / Lina it's like I'm just replaying the same match over and over for months on end. It doesn't help that the heroes I love playing are all incredibly weak atm (Naix and Visage are raped by axe (Counter helix works on familiars ROFL, also qops pure damage ult instagibs them now fyi.), Invoker and druid are just kind of weak.

Finally, but also kind of relevent, I've lost all interest in professional dota because of the reshuffles. I used to stay up till 2am + to watch games (I live in Australia) and would feel genuine excitement to see Fnatic, Na'vi, Alliance play etc. Now I couldn't tell you the line up of a single team and couldn't be bothered to learn it since it'll change in 2 weeks. I actually think DOTA should adopt a circuit similar to league so that there are 2/3 major tournaments a year.. or make contracts more stringent so teams have to stay together for at least 6 months. Stop with this "lol, we came fourth in our first tourney... better just disband now since we won't win TI" shit.

TL;Dr - Stagnant meta and degenerative pro scene make Acrim a sad boy

Played for 9 years, starting from with freaking Brazilians on it. Stopped playing after rubber band mechanic

No, 9 players just don't like having the resources sucked off the map by 1 player.

Sniper Sanity, new movie by Icefraud Pictures about an american sniper slowly descending to insanity. Watch him as he transforms from a civilized man to a remaint what is supposed to be called human. Also co-written by M. Night Shaymalan

Edit: Oh no, my joke got way too out of control

True that. Even the deathball was more enjoyable

Is he a diddy main?

It's actually been since 6.78 for me. TI3 and everything prior was great, after that the pub meta became something I do not like.

Why is there APEM gold gain? Why allow neutrals xp to be shared for free? Why did the raxes go from both having regen to melee being very hard to kill? Little stuff you might think but it makes gigantic differences when it comes down to the hero pool.

And then the comeback mechanics and post ti4 pushing nerfs - I hate the overall mechanic changes. Icefrog could have just nerfed the problem heroes.

Yep, my regular group barely plays dota anymore, if at all.

Leaving Dota to CSGO because of community is hilarious

Start game godlike as Bristleback, lose to never ending crits or bashes from Jugg/Troll...

Same here, playing Cities Skylines, till the next patch arrives.

In pubs, nobody takes towers. Even in deathball meta

Actually yeah, now that I think about it some of my friends have just dropped the game this patch where they never did with older ones. I love Dota too much, and have no good alternatives, to give it up that way myself. However, I have been noticing a tendency towards complete boredom (no attention/patience for it) whenever I watch a pro game. It feels like nothing matters anymore, like each individual game's story is no longer clear nor important-- like it's just a circus and sometimes somebody wins and sometimes they don't.

I made the mistake and tried to go on with my usual early game heavy support style. This got me loosing 300 mmr. After a 10 games losing streak i stopped playing solo ranked.

Bot matches don't help, I still verse axe, jug, lina and sniper every game -.-

The thing is that there was no "problem heroes", nor was there a "push strat problem". It's entirely fictional based on the incredibly poor performance of VG and the excellent performance of Newbee in the TI4 finals. TI4 as a tournament was excellent. The finals were poor because one of the contestants was playing like crap.

There was a community outrage due to the finals and that made 6.80 change a lot of things that didn't require changing.

I don't even see Sniper or Axe to be imbalanced - they are quite decent heroes now, for once. Sniper was absolutely overlooked before and having another hero available in the game is a great thing. Troll might need his ultimate toned down (IAS every 30 seconds really isn't balanced in any regard, imagine Centuar's Ultimate having a 30 seconds cooldown).

Change the gold+exp gains back to what it was pre-6.80 and take a look at Troll's Ultimate and you'll have inspiring gameplay again.

I noticed my friends began their DotA decline during the New Bloom 2015 pay-to-win event. I probably stopped here as well.

Edit/Addendum - Went from 15-30 hours of DotA/week to less to barely playing at all. After a long shift at work I would open up dotA but then remind myself that the game would be a shitfest. I don't play unless I have at least two other enjoyable people with me but many of my DotA buddies are on hiatus until the next patch.

I feel you really hit the nail on the head with most of your points. I feel the same way. It's not worth playing a really active support, as the outcome of the game will be dictated 40 mins in. Same goes for most offlane cores and non hardcarry mids. If you want to carry your game to victory, you just have to farm decently with PA/troll/sniper and hope for some nice crits/stunprocs/headshots in a late game fight and win the game from it.

One example would be playing Puck(could be changed to another semicarry) mid. You are against a PA(could be troll, ta or another hero with clear power spikes). You win farm, get runes, probably get a few side lane kills etc. You are forcing the PA to farm with dagger and run home a few times. Eventually PA falls back to jungle, get 1-2 core items, hit a powerspike (maybe BKB/basher and level 16) and proceed to win the game from rubber band mechanics.

What I used to like in Dota was that you could influence the game during its all stages and have impact on the result equally between roles. Now all you need is a troll with a BKB.

Dota player since 2008, I've never stopped playing at least for a week. That's the first time in all these years I've only played 5~10 matches in a month.

I used to play quite a bit and now, not so much. The current meta is just garbage imo. The mechanics are awful and 20 - 30 min games get drawn out to 50 min + because you can't take high ground or rubber-band.

We need pre-nerf Tresdin back. You know, the one where Duel would disable passives. Seriously why was it even nerfed Legion wasn't picked back then anyways

I just came back from the smash sub reading about the Diddy nerf. I CAN'T ESCAPE THE HOO HAH.

I rarely play lately... The rubber band mechanics is one of the main reason why. As an early game roaming support, that mechanics kinda nullified my presence in game :(

It's insane how the anti-Tinker circlejerk not only survived but also got stronger.

Combination of comeback mechanic and troll pickers has killed my enjoyment of the game. At no other point in the history of dota has a carry down 5k net worth still been able to, not just beat, but utterly smash the opposing team. Even void needed several items to do his shit. Troll just needs helm sny bkb. And this combined with the comeback mechanic means you get fucking insane 10k exp swings in the late game. Haven't touched the game in 2 weeks. PJSalt.

It doesn't matter that the game is objectively fairer because of the patches if you're punished for playing outside of the meta.

If I wanted to auto-lose for not picking a small selection 'meta' heroes, or not building some gay item, I'd go back to League.

If your meta is all you can do in the game then your game is shit.

It just seems to have been dumbed down so much to make it newbie-friendly that it is becoming boring and homogenous. It is now a far less strategical or nuanced game. It has a very simple meta with a very low skill-ceiling that will trash anything unusual.

id consider this 1% decrease PRETTY FUCKING HUGE actually, game is supposed to be growing

Not only that but Void could still be outplayed by baiting out his Chrono. Tinker needed a lot of mechanical practice, Brewmaster needed some sort of micro. You can't kite a hero who runs at 522 movespeed, has a slow, is a ranged and melee hero, and only needs to right click you. This patch has a lot of the easy to play heroes that need minimal skill to win games.

i just stopped after that haha hoho bitch started recking every single game

Tinker was never even that bad. He wasn't above 50% in pro or pub win rate before the nerf!

People just don't like getting insta-killed.

A little. Huge 1800 castrange. 3 charges. Vision. And 30% slow.

Atm it's the best ability in the game i think AND it works extremly well with everything sniper can do also. Don't forget he has another slow with headshot. And if you manage to get away from that, he can regain vision with shrapnel easy and just use his ult without even walkin a single step. It's just impossible to juke sniper in any way or form and that is just wrong.

Just put that into perspective by looking at other slows. Warlock for example has to channel his slow, it gives no vision and does no damage and has a castrange of only 700.

There seems to be almost no reason to pick hard supports now, any hero that dont need much farm to do well in lane but still have good lategame are just too good right now

Even fucking Ursa , that alone should point out how ridiculous that hero ia

It's more that those are the frustrating games. When I lose my lane, I don't expect winning to be likely/easy. When my team wins the laning stage, I expect to feel that tangible advantage (and currently don't).

Me and my brother quit the game indeed soon after the current patch hit. We were both 5.5k players when 5k meant something (todays 6k+ equivalent) What is really scary that my brother has been playing for 10 years and myself for 1.5 years (about 3000 games, yes I clocked a lot of games really fast), yet we got bored only recently.

In retrospect we got bored because the game got a lot worse in terms of fun. Here is what I feel the culprits are:

Streak gold punish you for a good play, because it is hard to not die once during the whole game and when you die you usually give you all the gold you earned by outplaying plus even more exp because you are over leveled.

Comeback mechanics made the games feel really painful. In lower brackets people don't know how to play the game properly and will throw on highground pushes and in higher skill games you just wait and farm even more before your highground push. All this is super boring, punish you for good early and mid game play and along with some cancer heroes like sniper it is very hard to push highground. They can be playing shit the whole early and mid game, yet they are still in the game and can possibly come back just by defending.

As long as dota exist there were OP heroes every patch, yet I feel that lately certain heroes got even more OP than before with no real drawbacks that can just win games with 1 button press. Heroes like Troll or Jugg, Lina, Axe are prime examples. Because of this power creep many other heroes are not even usable because their design or balance is really old, or the anti push meta game threw them out of the sight. Sure, you can say that every hero can win, but if you play in the highest skill bracket you know that we have 100 hero pool, but really maybe 10-15 heroes are good if you want to win more than 50% at the highest level of play. If you play other heroes apart from the top ones, you gonna be lower that 50% win rate losing to 1 button Jugger, Troll or Lina. This makes the game really boring really fast. Nowadays you don't even need to hit Lina stun, because you have an Eul - this is so sad.

So to sum up, I don't play Dota anymore because it punishes me for playing well with the comeback mechanics, majority of heroes are really weak and the strongest heroes don't require much skill to play and don't have really any weaknesses. On top of that report system is broken which really shows when you play with 1k-2k lower mmr players because the MM is broken. I would even wait for 10m to queue just don't place me with 1k mmr lower players than me.

as a result, get a match when enemies pick sniper/troll/jug/allthisshittogether and just go as five since 15-20 min and push towers to the ancient

This. Deathball Dota was bad before. But I feel like it's even worse now. Literally every single game is the same. Pick sniper/troll/jug/whoever synergizes with those guys. And even if by some miraculous luck that the other team doesn't, they're still going to be 5-man ganking and pushing lanes until it's GG starting at the 15 min mark.

Part of why I got so into Dota was because it felt like every game was different, like every experience was fresh, that I was learning something every time I played. Right now it feels like the opposite, and the meta is so stale that it's really sapping a lot of my enthusiasm for the game.

This patch has a lot of easy to play heroes that need minimal skill that are statistically stronger than heroes that require skill it's like, i can play my mind out on puck, get 5 man dreamcoils, dodge ultimates with phase shift and i still wouldn't be half as effective as i would be if i picked Ho Ho ha ha

Could it be the Troll/Sniper/Jugg/Axe meta killing the fun of the game?

Recent research shows that 90% of mid players win their lane.

Actually, for those of us in the higher brackets of mmr (I'm 4800), Tinker was extremely broken. The hero scales insanely well with player ability. Have you ever faced a 5000+ mmr tinker? God forbid... unless you seriously counterpick him and shut him down hard, he can take over the late game, and pushing into march of the machines was nigh impossible.

Same here :/ I'm a support player and I was climbing steadily in ranked up to 3400. Was playing carry or support.

But then I just started dropping. Took a nearly 2 week break because I was just raging and only saw my teammates flaws, not mine. Came back and fucking every game is 4 cores. Even with 2 supports that zone the offlane and gank mid I lose against 4 cores. I even picked shadow shaman so I could push towers alone instead of fight. No go, still just food for cores in late game.

I dropped to 2950 now and just stopped ranked. Play unranked. But I don't really enjoy it compared to earlier patches.

As a support player this patch is by far the worst I've ever played. And like the trend is, my friends play way less and a barely go to play captain's mode anymore.

I am so glad that GTA V is out on PC, first time I ever wanted a break from playing a patch in Dota 2 :)

In my opinion it's because the troll faglord and the sniper being so absurdly strong. Troll means you can't go melee carry anymore, except for lancer who can handle him and actually beats him in late fights. Sniper means you've won midlane because shrapnel is so absurdly strong and has a fking global range. It's just boring. But so was the deathball meta. We simply need that new patch really badly.

He descended with such a frequency that he became a midget.

Don't forget the flat 50 manacost at all levels! Despite the fact that his int growth is motherfucking 2.6 (better than QoP, Puck, Invoker, and Storm Spirit to name a few)! Ho ho ha ha!

I'm just not having fun with serious modes that involve thought anymore. Stopped playing AP and CD entirely until the next patch hits. Still playing lots of SD, RD, AD, ARDM, etc.

Mix it up if you're not having fun, there are modes that are free from this meta.

I agree with everything except shrapnel. The reason I say this is because of the slow it grants over a huge aoe on little cooldown, which I feel is a little unbalanced

Came back and fucking every game is 4 cores. Even with 2 supports that zone the offlane and gank mid I lose against 4 cores.

It's disgustingly true. And unless your team absolutely fucking stomps on their throat to punish the greedy 4 core picks you lose in the end, because the meta favors longer games and so there's a big chance of those cores all picking up their 1-2 items they need to have a huge impact. There's a VERY big chance of that happening when your team doesn't adapt to them picking 4 cores and pushing hard right away. Too often teams will gain an early lead over the 4 core teams and then ease off on the pressure, giving the other team time to farm, catch up and find pickoffs on the map to rubber band themselves back into the game. Meanwhile the lone support or dual supports are feeding so much gold towards wards and support items that they don't get their core items, which after about 10-15 minutes just makes them food in this patch as you mentioned.

There's just such an abundance of gold these days between the gold gain buffs and the rubber band mechanic, so even losing hard early with 4 cores gives you a great opportunity to come back come mid-game and then have easily caught up in the gold and xp charts. It's awful, it's disheartening, and it's having me play more and more GTA V and Dying Light instead of this game that doesn't reward good early play anymore. I don't want to play a game where 4 greedy sniper/troll/jugg/drow pickers can succeed the vast majority of the time right now, even if your classically constructed team ganks them all multiple times and wins the early game hard.

upvote for ded gaem post !

Even the player of my old highschool team (20+ playerbase) are just casually logging in atm. Mostly playing duo or 3 stacks now 2 times a week or some solo games. pubs (EUW+EUE) are fine though, lots of cummunication going on. almost always everyone with open mic.

when will valve realise that hats and rubberbands are not attracting people?

Icafraud was sad that he got outplayed by her

She really was the best anti-carry in the game, what is void without his bash and backtrack, pa without evasion, ursa without his stacks, etc. ?

My friends left game and started CS GO because of toxic community and 6.83.

Damn what a good game indeed!

More or less. They are more or less always in a game and it sucks. Troll alone invalidates most melee carries if the enemy picks him.

Couple of things I'm tired of:

Power creep, One hero gets buffed until they are too strong so icefrog has to buff all of the other heroes instead of just nerfing the hero back to what it was last patch.

Axe having a blackhole on a ten second cooldown.

Earth Spirit's shitty kick mechanic will never get fixed or reverted back to the old one because people argue making his kick clumsy as fuck balances him because he is even harder to play now.

Arbitrary shit like increased magic resistance and reduced spawn time on Meepo. He can snowball way too quickly, and it requires way too many resources to keep him down. Being able to win against a skilled Meepo shouldn't be impossible without picking Earth Shaker.

Many carries that exist are now have been getting slowly buffed and are becoming just as strong as supports in the early game. Most games 3 carries are totally viable. So instead of a support heavy team having early game dominance they are more or less equal in teamfight against a team of mostly carries.

Gimmicky stuff like buffing PA to give her more attention during her arcana release. I'm not really a fan of the disappearing minimap icon when she is out of range. It's an interface element that shouldn't change, it doesnt add immersion and it just seems gimmicky.

Every time I see CM's fucking dog I think it's a courier, please give us the option to hide it.

Mask of Madness way too cost efficient for the current Sniper Jugg bullshit meta. Make the recipe more expensive

PL has a phase shift, manta style, and short ranged blink all in one spell on a 8 second cool down. This brings me to my next point of one spell becoming a complicated list of spells because Valve decided that adding passives and secondary characteristics to already existing spells would make a hero viable.

Slark being able to fart off bkb piercing ult disables and disjoint everything every 5 seconds and have a built in heart + 100 move speed.

This shit right here is spot on, i remember when T1 towers fell before the 5 min mark. Hell there was even a time where you could predict if it fell before the 2 min mark in the old compendium. Now its a bloody miracle if people want to take a tower before the 30 min mark in pubs....

The rubber band mechanic isn't the worst part of it (to me). I just hate that there are like 5 heroes that are like two tiers ahead of the next strongest group of heroes. I haven't played in probably a month and a half and since I've left I've heard it's only gotten worse.

I thought I was the only one. Current patch : A godlike pudge dies to a 0-7 jugger's ks omni...the game is lost.

You aren't accounting for growth of the playerbase. Pulling data for two years most months showed more players than the previous month. Aside from new bloom these past 4 months are the only time I can see where the numbers hovered around the same point.

Also when you have such a surge of players you would expect to retain some of them at least, since that's the whole point of making events.

Feel you homie. Been playing for 9 years and now I am playing once in a while out of old time sake which make me hate it again after 1 game

Had one of those the other day with Bristle on the team. We got 15 kills in less than 10 min (mostly in BB's offlane). One teamfight is lost tryint to push into their raxes and what should've been a 30 min game stretched to 65 min because of Sniper and Axe.

Because you absolutely CANT steamroll a pub anymore unless you are just way better than your opponents. A friend of mine that used to play aggressive heroes like Bounty and Enchantress a lot (so not Midas Enchantress) has completely stopped playing because he thinks that especially Bounty just doesn't matter in most games, and I have to agree - snowball heroes and snowball items are really bad right now.

The other thing is that no matter how far ahead you were - in the volatile environment of pubs, there is always somebody that overextends, and every single mistake of that sort stretches a game that could have ended at 20 minutes to a 50+ minute snoozefest. Honestly, all my recent games have been that long, and that's just not fun.

It seems like large parts of the game have been trivialized and just comes down to hero picks. Before, because you could keep an advantage much more easily, you could actually win games with your goofball line-up if you just played well. Now if you do something unorthodox (i.e. don't pick troll or sniper) you can expect to lose, because it is so hard to end the game soon enough and without giving up much gold for the enemy carry to become un-beatable. And holy shit is it boring playing hard support now.

It's like a game of chess where the first 50 moves count for nothing and you win based on what colour chess pieces you chose when you started.

This is when my decline started. What an atrocious event that was.

Im actually impressed that valve would release one of the worst patches ever and then fuck off for 1/3 of a year afterwards.

But at least Source 2 will make anime real!

My friends have slowly migrated to CS:GO, and we have all over 1k+ hrs clocked into the game (not even counting Dota 1). GTA V just came out and that was the final nail in the coffin, we all jumped ship. Spin to Win, Hee Hee Hoo Hoo

I don't agree with Random Draft being classed as a non-serious mode that doesn't involve thought (though obviously not available in ranked), but agree with the sentiment of mixing things up beyond All Pick.

Almost exclusively play Random Draft for unranked these days, it entirely eliminates the issue of seeing the same heroes in almost every game. Not to mention you take out the sort of people who just pick one hero every game no matter what.

The 3k and 4k range, especially cm, was nothing but death prophet shadow shaman lone druid pugna venomancer furion enigma, most games ended in 20 minutes for me, or were at least decided in that amount of time. Comebacks were genuinely earned, not this forced rubberband nonsense.

I'm against Lina mid more and more in pubs, that shit isn't balanced. I'm scared if Pros start running it consistently like they do the other cancers.

The problem wasn't that he was OP, it was that he was arguably the single most annoying hero to play against in the history of dota.

Yeah, I feel like the ability to have impact as a support is particularly low in this patch/meta :(

Rubberband. Needs to go.

Artificially manufacturing comebacks from an advantage that is essentially "We need to push but they have too many buildings" is fucking tripe, boring and not a comeback. Comebacks before rubberband were exciting because you knew you were at a disadvantage and you knew that the only way to work back into the game was to genuinely outplay your opponents. Nowadays if you get one lucky fight or one of your team-mates does something stupid like diving their rax, then your progress is hard-reset.

What this means is that even when you do well, the teams will be artificially equalized past a certain point. It's almost inevitable. What this means is that the only thing that really matter (when everyone's on the same skill level - and for the record, I think the MMR rating has done a good job of this) are the flavour of the month picks. Being ahead doesn't matter because you might get locked down and die in a fight. Farming quickly doesn't matter because if you're further ahead then they just get more gold for killing you. It's just the fucking heroes.

It's like, Sniper or jugo were always easy, they were a noobs friend but mostly got rekt by good play. Now he has cheese items aND skills and suddenly noob heroes are pawning you even when you are playing invoker like a piano.

"Many carries that exist are now have been getting slowly buffed and are becoming just as strong as supports in the early game. Most games 3 carries are totally viable. So instead of a support heavy team having early game dominance they are more or less equal in teamfight against a team of mostly carries."

This so much. It sucks so hard when as a support you are actually WEAKER in the early game than a carry, someone like bristleboss literally has a laning stage as strong as you or stronger.

Cause its annoying as fuck to be on a 3 kill streak with a ganking mid, having ur first core item and a good level advantage on everyone, destroying ur lane then getting killed by a level 6 troll cocksucker with brown fucking boots and watching him go up 3 damn levels and getting a fucking rampage at 15 fucking mins. Hero needs fuck all to do retarded damage. The glory days of fancy mids like puck, ta, etc is dead and gone. Hit creeps, hit towers, repeat..troll, sniper, etc don't have to outplay anyone to win..

I think the biggest overlooked issue here is the reduction in assist gold. I don't know when it happened but I used to play a lot of roaming supp too, help with a few kills and you're set. Just a few games ago, however I played roaming supp POTM of the moon, helped secure the first blood, and only got 25g for landing the arrow and right clicking and securing our mid got the kill. That's ridiculous. Half a CS for assisting (actually initiating and guaranteeing) first blood. Game sucked as I was poor as balls.

And 50% of the time you're watching a stream, the game is paused anyway.

Wins meant to feel good. Losses felt awful but you felt you learnt something. Now wins feel random and boring and losses feel silly. You had 9 factors of uncertainty and your own fluctuating skill level before, now you got the comeback, how minor it might be (some argue), which makes everything seem to not be your achievement. It is the difference between cooking your own food without a recipe and getting it spoonfed by your mother.